Board Thread:Clean up Concerns/@comment-28650358-20160604154019/@comment-3581997-20160605234041

Morality becomes subjective when analyzed too much by enough people. As we are a Wikipedia the best way to remain objective is to focus on role in the story. We need to look for those who act as Antagonists. Now of course this can lead to some truly dumb things too. But since it allows for less opinion based squabbling we can back-up and validate "villains" based on clear actions in their respective stories. Many Many articles have been based entirely on fan hate or tried to be removed based on fan love. And so letting anything outside of practical story role influence us is just asking for a mess. Don't focus on "Is this person evil?", instead I would encourage we focus on "Is the person an intentional hindrance to the protagonists?".

I think as long as we can get a full article (at bare minimum one paragraph following intro) of information about the character's time with a role as an antagonist we can still count them. After all how often do comic book villains get made heroes just for marketing gimmicks? To say nothing of most anime's blatant fan-service. "Oh it's okay that character you liked is a good guy/gal now. It is alright to hope they win now." We would need to discount Vegeta, Dr.Doom Apocalypse, Mystique, Magneto, Albter Simon, Pig-Leg Pete, Death (Supernatural), Darla, Spike, The Turks, ect ect.

To remove characters who only started off as villains may well prevent us from going over plot points in a certain settings. Now there needs to be a bare minimum and the article needs to actually say how someone is an antagonist rather than just being the ravings of fan hate and cranks (I still remember that awful article on Moses that never gave any outline of who Moses was antagonizing and basically just said "Moses is a jerk if you think about it") but to remove a character's status as a "villain" because they eventually change, limits us greatly.

If you want Lapis removed fine. I could take or leave her in the role. But be very careful on why she is to be removed and the precedence being set.